The Rise of UKIP

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ApuNahasapeemapetilon

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Apr 16, 2008
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-22382098

UKIP had very good results across the board in the recent council elections.

Much of the speculation is that it's a protest vote due to the Tory-Lib Dem coalition.

Do you think this trend might continue into general elections, what does this mean for the UK?

One of the major issues for UKIP is the EU, and "Sovereignty".

What does Sovereignty mean, why is this important, and do you think the EU reduces the UK's Sovereignty? If so, why is this a bad thing?
 
It's gotta be good for Labour. A split right wing vote plays right into their hands.

I'm pleased to see that the Lib Dems are still getting kicked about.
 
The current crop of Tories have alienated the traditional working class conservative voters. Their seeming love of the American Tea Party style conservatism (which the last US election suggests isn't even that popular there ) is a massive miscalculation, and their apparent plan to penalise the working class who are increasingly struggling while cutting huge breaks to the wealthy who aren't struggling is turning people off in droves. There's also continuing anger against the banks and government's unwillingness to take then to task, and Cameron and Osborne's past as investment bankers is working against them.
The truth is that even for working class conservatives national institutions are sacred cows, and the harsh spending cuts are worrying people.
The sad thing is that traditional conservatism has historically served to blunt more extreme right wing politics. UKIP panders directly to the Daily Mail brigade
 
I was a supporter of Lib Dems before the coalition and am also glad they are getting what they deserve.

Would people agree that UKIP is a cross between the Tories and the BNP in terms of their politics?

Other than immigration, EU, I'm not really sure what their policies are. I'm listening to LBC phone in about people who voted for UKIP right now, and most conversations start with "I'm not a racist but". Then they complain about the EU but can't explain how it has negatively affected our lives.
 
A guy who kept repeating he's a lawyer, made a couple of interesting points but James O'Brien shut him down!

Apparently the issue is people are not comfortable with the idea of unelected bureaucrats in Brussels affecting our legislature.

Someone came out with the figure of 80% of our legislature is coming from the EU :s.

They have a listen live option, and so far I haven't heard anything positive about UKIP.

http://www.lbc.co.uk/listen-live-3578
 
The European parliament is just that. As previously UKIP's main presence was MEPs that seems an odd argument.
Of course the other question is how much effect do they really have? While EU law influences our laws by and large they are our laws. I don't especially agree with European arrest warrants, but our elected officials signed up to them.
 
Lol.

James: What has the EU stopped us doing?
Caller: Stopped as from deporting terrorists!
James: Like who?
Caller: Abu Qatada
James: He hasn't been convicted.
Caller: Oh come on don't give me that crap he's an illegal immigrant.
James: Sigh, *hangs up*.

Lol I love James O'Brian.
 
It always does seem to come down to an issue of a referendum.
New caller, new issue.

His son can't do a paper round because it's controlled by the EU? :| This is new to me.
 
Yes, but why? We are a representative democracy. That's how our system works. If the bulk of people felt that strongly about it then UKIP would have been much stronger from the get go.
 
I think that's one of the issues.

A lot of Labour voters were disillusioned after the previous regime, a lot of votes went to Lib Dems, and some went to Respect.

The last election most of those disillusioned Labour voters who may have voted Lib Dem are now probably regretting it.

People are now also peeved with the three major parties.

This was the biggest rise in UKIP votes ever, I think they got the second highest amount of votes after labour in this council election, tories came in third, and Lib Dems 4th.

How will this translate into the general election?

Could we possibly be turning into a 4 party system? Or will the Lib Dems be pushed out with the UKIPS moving in?

I'm learning something new all the time about the EU it seems, apparently they decide on the size of our banana's and apples and this leads to wastage.

Apparently 9-10 ingredients in Cheese do not need to be listed as ingredients because of EU law.

This is news to me.
 
It's the European Council that holds the power.

I bet the EU doesn't feel too democratic to those countries who are reliant on Germany footing the bill for them.

UKIP don't seem like they could organise merryment in a distillery, which is a shame because they are marginalizing the arguments about waste and corruption in the EU, of which there is plenty.
 
The European council has no legislative powers and is mostly comprised of heads of state. You can argue that yes they do have the power because they're the people with executive power in their member states, but with or without an EU legislature this would be the case anyway.
Indeed if you scrapped the EU government apparatus what you'd be left with IS the European council.
Again, it'd feel even less democratic if they were in debt to Germany rather than the EU (or perhaps China?).
 
I don't think the UKIP votes will transpire into future general elections, these are pretty much protest vote's to send a message to the Torys about Europe & immigration, they've probably gained a lot of vote's out of the recently publicised Abu Qatarda business re-surfacing. Personally I have no idea on UKIP's policy's on the economy, schools, NHS or anything else other than Europe, I don't really know too much about their immigration policy either. It would be nice to see/hear a representive of UKIP actually talk about these policy's rather than just the EU issue's, they may have some credible idea's, who knows?!
 
So far, would I be correct in saying, that the general consensus on UKIP from MAP is a negative one?

I wonder if (I'm sure there probably are) there are any UKIP supporters on MAP? I'm curious to know what the appeal is, whether it is just EU/Immigration, or whether there is something else to it.
 
that might not matter as much if we leave the union and take a large chunk of labour's vote with us, somthing the rise of UKIP can only make more likely, although that in its self might be a mute point as many people are waking up to what labour have become and we have of course never swayed a single election. If we don't go and Labour leans heavily on the tory's antics on the NHS and maybe even promises to reverse some of them (dare we hope) they could do very well in the next general election.
 
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